Talk:Portlaoise

On 18 June 2021, it was proposed that this article be moved from Port Laoise to Portlaoise. The result of the discussion was moved.

Link for Alison Miller

The link for Alison Miller does not go to the proper person

fixed. --Wikipelli ^Talk 22:51, 5 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Gay Capital?

Where is the reference for this and the "1 in 10" people are gay statistic? There has only been one gay event in the town in recent years and oddly enough that took place last week, possibly around the time of the edit. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.153.4.102 (talk) 10:16, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

It's a wind-up, surely, based on it being in the former "Queen's County"?Red Hurley (talk) 11:31, 7 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Out of date

"Portlaoise is home to the maximum security Portlaoise Gaol, home to most of the Northern Irish terrorists, and to the Midlands Prison."

This sentence taken from the article is out of date. Portlaois jail is not used for persons convicted of "terrorist" offences anymore to any great extent. Many have been released under the terms of the Good Friday agreement and most of those remaining have been transferred to another facility in Ballinasloe.

Port Laoise or Portlaoise

Part 1

This article needs to be moved to Portlaoise, the town's official name. However, "Portlaoise" already exists as a redirect to "Port Laoise". Techno-savants, please help. -- Picapica 19:33, 4 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Agree fully. I just hate people breaking names up like that and trying to be posh! - whether it is Castle Island for Castleisland, FitzPatrick for Fitzpatrick, Glasnevin North for Ballymun or Oylegate for Oilgate! (Sarah777 00:04, 5 November 2007 (UTC))[reply]

Move now effected. The redirect thing seemed not to matter. Sometimes, it seems, I worry too much! -- Picapica (talk) 21:17, 26 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

As far as I can tell Portlaoise is the English name and Port Laoise is the Irish name...per the TSM, road signs only read "Port Laoise" (with a space, and in italics only) and not "Portlaoise" (well, that is the way most of them read, but there are some ones with both). Since this is the English Wikipedia of course we should use the English name. --Rdd (talk) 12:14, 26 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

When was the name changed from Maryborough to Portlaoise? 1922, or later? If anyone knows, could they add it to the history section? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.47.242.160 (talk) 19:44, 3 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This change needs to be reversed. Port Laoise is the Irish for Port Laoise. Ie. Port Laoise is also how it is spelt in English. I refer to logainm.ie, the official source on town names in Ireland which states: "Port Laoise gin. Phort Laoise ainm deimhnithe (Gaeilge). Port Laoise (Béarla)". Can we please have this changed back. 08:46, 31 August 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.44.94.194 (talk)

No discussion has been forthcoming on this topic and seeing as there is an official source mentioned by user @ 86.44.94.194, I have affected the move. I have also cited the official documentation. Jamesnp (talk) 23:00, 21 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Part 2

The Placenames Database of Ireland calls the place Port Laoise (in English and Irish) while the Ordnance Survey map calls it Portlaoise (in English) and Port Laoise in the first national language (the Michelin road map follows suit), so it is yet another official dog's breakfast. — O'Dea 04:04, 18 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I have just "driven into Portlaoise" on Google's Street View, observing official road signs as I went along. All signs on the approach into Port Laoise from the east on the R445 road, off the M7 motorway, indicate that Port Laoise (two words) is straight ahead. Nearing the town, a large notice erected by Laois County Council advertises Portlaoise (one word) Main Drainage Scheme, a different spelling. Finally, on reaching the entrance to the town itself, the town sign indicating your arrival announces, Portlaoise (one word). It is clear that both spellings are in offical use and, arguably, correct, but we can't continue to rename this Wikipedia article about the town back and forth, yo-yoing between Port Laoise and Portlaoise. Google returns 2,560,000 results when "Port Laoise" (in quotes) is searched for; 689,000 when Port Laoise (without quotes) is searched for; and 579,000 results when Portlaoise is searched for. These experiments with Street View and Google Search do not appear to have promoted resolution of the article name question. — O'Dea 10:57, 18 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I contacted Laois County Council to ask about the name of the town and received this response:

I reply to your query as follows but not so sure how satisfactory my reply is for you. I checked the book entitled "Ainmneacha Gaeilge na mBailte Poist published by Arna Fhoilsiú as Oifig an tSoláthair , Baile Átha Cliath, and in the chapter on Laois (Contae Laoise in Irish) the english spelling of the town is documented as "Portlaoise" and the Irish spelling is documented as "Port Laoise". However, when I checked a different book entitled "Log-Ainmneacha – Irish Placenames" by Risteárd Ó Foghludha the spelling is as follows: English spelling: Port Laoighise; Irish spelling: Port Laoighse. Hope this information is of some help.

The research did not resolve between Portlaoise and Port Laoise; instead, it added a third variant into the mix to confuse matters further: Port Laoighise. Since we cannot cite a definitive ruling to guide our spelling of the article, I suggest we vote on it and assign the result as the agreed article name. What do you think? I vote for Portlaoise. — O'Dea 11:24, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

Given that both are in use, I don't think it matters which gets the title, but Portlaoise should be promoted from "Port Laoise (also Portlaoise)" to "Port Laoise or Portlaoise".

Ó Foghludha's book was published in 1935. Laoighis-->Laois is a change that happened when the caighdeán oifigiúil simplified Irish spelling somewhat after 1945. Port Laoighise --> Port Laoise is a consequence of that. So just as we shouldn't have County Laoighis, likewise we can rule out Portlaoighise and Port Laoighise. The cited logainm.ie gives Port Laoise as both English and Irish, which tallies with SI 1975 No.133 and its replacement SI 2005 No.59; however while those are official as regards the Irish name, I'm not sure they are so as regards the English name. Under section 76 of the Local Government Act 1946, a place can petition for a change of name, as Ceanannus Mór --> Kells in 1993. But I doubt that the official "English" name "Portlaoighise" adopted in the 20s was ever officially changed to "Port Laoise" or "Portlaoise". I don't think there was a law passed after 1958 that the Irish spellings of all placenames would automatically be modernised to the new standard. Of course, Wikipedia uses common name, not official name, but the latter can be a helpful tiebreaker if the former is unclear. Of course if the official name is also unclear, that doesn't help.

Searching irishstatutebook.ie give mixed results

SI 1961 No.5 creates the "District Court Area of Port Laoise" in the "County of Laoighis", with court sittings to be held in "Portlaoighise".
SI 1985 No.109 states the County Electoral Area of "Port Laoighise" includes "The existing District Electoral Divisions of:— Ballyroan, Borris, Clondarrig, Clonkeen, Colt, Cullenagh, Kilcolmanbane, Portlaoighise Rural and the Town of Portlaoighise."
SI 2008 No. 44 calls the County Electoral Area "Portlaoise" and the "The electoral divisions of Ballyroan, Borris, Clondarrig, Clonkeen, Colt, Cullenagh, Kilcolmanbane, Portlaoighise Rural, Portlaoighise Urban, Shaen."
Local Govt Act 2001 Sched 6 part 2 "Former Town Commissioners" includes "Portlaoise"

Maybe the urban district was not renamed but the town was. Which would be a nice distinction, along the lines of Derry City Council vs City of Londonderry. In fact, logainm gives the districts' English names as Portlaoighise (Maryborough) Urban and Portlaoighise (Maryborough) Rural jnestorius^(talk) 22:15, 1 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the informative contribution, jnestorius. While it does not resolve the question into a single answer and, indeed, adds one more variant into the mix, your documentation of official sources is helpful. Following your remarks, I have changed the opening of the article to read as follows, "Port Laoise or Portlaoise (historically spelled Port Laoighise or Portlaoighise) is the county town of County Laois...".

While I agree with you that "Given that both are in use, I don't think it matters which gets the title", I raised the page title question because of repeated back-and-forth article renaming. Perhaps it may be left alone in future, but if it is moved again to rename it, I will revert it, just to keep the name stable, not out of any loyalty to the present name, which is Port Laoise. I actually prefer Portlaoise because I always thought that was "its name", but what the hell. — O'Dea (talk) 13:35, 2 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

As regards common name, on further reflection, I think "Portlaoise" is significantly more common in English than "Port Laoise":

Spelling	laois.ie	independent.ie	irishtimes.com	tcm.ie	oireachtas.ie	Google books
"Portlaoise"	site:laois.ie +"Portlaoise" 5690	site:independent.ie +"Portlaoise" 13100	site:irishtimes.com +"Portlaoise" 39400	site:tcm.ie +"Portlaoise" 15000	site:oireachtas.ie +"Portlaoise" 12000	8140
"Port Laoise"	site:laois.ie +"Port Laoise" 28	site:independent.ie +"Port Laoise" 23	site:irishtimes.com +"Port Laoise" 70	site:tcm.ie +"Port Laoise" 171	site:oireachtas.ie +"Port Laoise" 163	1150

jnestorius^(talk) 11:40, 3 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

With 99.5 % Portlaoise on the county council's website and 99.8 % Portlaoise in The Irish Times, there can be no doubt that this should be moved back to Portlaoise. Bennicio (talk) 10:55, 1 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Maryborough to Portlaoise

As with other place names in the Republic of Ireland, it would be useful to know when the name was changed, in this case from Maryborough to Portlaoise. I'm guessing it was in 1922, but I don't know. If somebody does, could they add it to the history section? Thanks.

In the 1970s, as I recall, and many of us country folk still call it Maryborough because we always have. Portlaoise was definitely invented after 1922 to make us forget about the plantation of the 1550s.Red Hurley (talk) 12:35, 2 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Only 50 years off, Red. [1] "Local Govt. Order 233/1929 alters the name of Maryborough Urban to Portlaoiġise (one word)". The Irish name was not "invented" after 1922; it was the name of the pre-plantation fort, and had continual currency in Irish, though not in English. If you will be snide, I suggest "resurrected" or "commandeered" would be a more accurate put-down. jnestorius^(talk) 13:39, 2 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, but I'm referring to what the inhabitants and neighbours called it in daily usage; the plain people of Ireland as distinct from the official class. By the 1970s Portlaoise was being used widely.Red Hurley (talk) 11:30, 7 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I certainly remember listening to an RTE program, before the Queen arrived, in which a fellow from Portlaoise claimed that Portlaoise was a 'made up name'. This seems to be a rather persistent view in some places. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.97.57.207 (talk) 10:11, 18 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"Historical population" box needs attention

Open it up, and it's got red error messages! PamD (talk) 14:41, 18 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

That is fixed now. — O'Dea 17:39, 18 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Picture

I think the current infobox picture (a stack of beerkegs outside a pub) is awful and should be changed. I've searched the Commons, Geograf and Flickr but I can't find anything suitable. ~Asarlaí 22:38, 1 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The picture currently in use is equally poor. It shows a busy dual carriageway from a fly-over bridge. I would argue it is not a good representation of the town. Is there any way a picture showing one of the main streets or well known landmarks can be displayed? User:Aerach — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.125.16.94 (talk) 19:21, 11 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

View from portlaoise blue bridge.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 17:52, 28 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Ss Peter and Paul's Church

Details on History of this Church which is now known via Shalom World TV 85.211.117.182 (talk) 14:16, 5 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 18 June 2021

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) Lennart97 (talk) 17:04, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Port Laoise → Portlaoise – The Town's name on all street signs,[2], [3], and in all government publications is Portlaoise. Port Laoise is one of several Irish translations, albeit the most prominent Irish translation used by CIE and above Portlaoise on street signs. Berocca Addict (talk) 12:06, 18 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Portlaoise is also used in most publications Irish Times, Irish Independent, Irish Examiner, Laois Nationalist, Laois Today .. I could add a lot more. Berocca Addict (talk) 13:27, 18 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Weak oppose The discussion above concluded that "the research did not resolve between Portlaoise and Port Laoise" and concerns were raised about "repeated back-and-forth article renaming". Dormskirk (talk) 15:30, 21 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- The previous debate was over a decade ago, and some of the points against are less so now. Issues include
  - Portlaoise town council called itself 'Portlaoise town council' See Photo
  - Log Anim is inconsistent, in some areas using Port Laoise, in others Portlaoise
  - Portlaoise is the English name used on all Portlaoise Street signs, in all Laois and Leinster media, on RTE, in general
  - Portlaoise is used in the names of the Prison, The Parish, Sports Teams, Tourist areas, The local council, the Governing Political party, educational institutions, Golf Clubs .. i could go on.
  - Portlaoise, as the name the town, council and official addresses, as well as social organisations, use is the WP:OFFICIAL name of the town, and Wikipedia is one of the very few areas that differ - Berocca Addict (talk) 19:20, 21 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support per exhaustive evidence by the nom. It seems more commonly spelled without a space. Checking the article's sources, the spelling without the space dominates the 21st-century sources. — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mellohi! (投稿) 04:48, 24 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.