Talk:Madge Oberholtzer

She also helped him write a nutrition book, One Hundred Years of Health.

The earliest reference I can find referring to this book is from David Mark Chalmers _Hooded Americanism: The History of the Ku Klux Klan_ (1965) which calls it Stephenson's book and makes no reference to Oberholtzer's working on it. I can find no earlier evidence that this book even exist. If it does, I doubt Oberholtzer had anything to do with it because it doesn't come up in any of the extensive newspaper reporting about the murder trial. Heathcliff (talk) 17:10, 12 August 2024 (UTC)

Untitled

Non-encyclopedic stuff moved from article:

Okay, Madge is on my grandmothers side. What I'm placing in here is what I have known from family stories,documentary's online, and from the History Channel(broadcasted on television).Note nothing on this information has been plagurized.

User:Someone else

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Erm, you added a date of birth, and then removed it... Was it wrong? -- Oliver P. 03:56 3 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Yes. -- Someone else 04:13 3 Jun 2003 (UTC) (err, well, at least I don't have any reason to believe it is right...)

Oh, okay. By the way, you did realise that my question was preceeded by an implicit "Well done for sorting out that article", didn't you? ;) Sorry, terribly rude of me there, jumping in with some nit-picking question after you'd done all the hard work... -- Oliver P. 04:17 3 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Well, I certainly hope you realize you'll need to try a great deal harder than that if you wish to achieve rude, let along terribly rude!<G> But thanks for the now-explicit clap-on-the-back. The edit conflicts were a bit harrying, when they go away I think there's a bit more work to do here:) -- Someone else 04:23 3 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Interesting story. Wikipedia is a good place to put on record those bits of history that are known to contributors but didn't make the official history books, as I did in Dog Tax War Ping 23:49 8 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Factual accuracy: poison?

The article says that Stephenson "made" Madge take poison, but in the "prosecution's opening statement" external link as well as the Klan history book I am currently reading (Hooded Americanism by David M. Chalmers) it says that Madge purchased the poison herself and took it without telling Stephenson. Where does the information that Stephenson made Madge take poison come from? silsor 01:43, Jan 29, 2005 (UTC)

Cross of Fire

I'm just wondering how much of this article is based on Cross of Fire rather than the factual accounts. I've no idea how close the film was to the reality. --MacRusgail 17:22, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Stephenson and the two Major Parties

Contrary to what used to be indicated in the article on D. C. Stephenson, Stephenson was affiliated with the Democratic Party from 1920 until 1924. He of course became Grand Dragon in November 1922. His switch to the Republicans came when an opportunity opened to leverage his position as Grand Dragon to take control of the Republican Party, almost two years into his leadership of the Indiana-area Klan. His attack on Oberholtzer occurred in March 1925, less than a year after he affilitated with the Republicans. For most of the period during which he was politically powerful, he was a Democrat. To suppress mention of his affilitation with the Democrats is simply an exercise in bad historiography. —12.72.68.229 10:09, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Really who cares. The Tweedledum-Tweedledee nature of American politics is pretty pathetic. --MacRusgail 17:10, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

Various sorts of people will care, amongst them some who are neither Republican nor Democrat, but simply want Wikipedia to be as accurate as possible. —12.72.68.209 23:19, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

Silliness from across the Pond

Mr. Stephenson was invaribaly acting on the part of the KKK and the attack was in line with some of their policies, perhaps the article should be more forgiving of Mr. Stephenson, it's not neutral and seems to make a big deal out of Oberholtzer's occupation and goals regarding illiteracy, it's prostituting her occupation as a way of making her the absolute victim, it should be facts. She was a teacher, she was helping combat illiteracy, she was raped and so on and so forth.

JBAK 13:16, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

You are substituting for fact haphazard speculation that cannot be fit to the facts.

• Had Stephenson's attack been in keeping with Klan policy, then most of the membership would have applauded, rather than defecting.
• The Klan was opposed to the empowerment of blacks, not literacy in general. Any presumption that an illiterate in the '20s was black is offensive.
• Stephenson courted Oberholtzer; this courtship was what enabled him to lure her to his home, whence he kidnapped her.

Further, the entry does not make “a big deal” out of Oberholtzer's goals — it identifies what the H_ll she actually did, which is especially useful as many on-line sources make the mistaken claim that she was a secretary (or indeed that she was Stephenson's secretary). And you contradict yourself in claiming that the attack was explained by an occupation that you don't want to be reported. —SlamDiego 06:11, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Evidently, you're a very troublesome person. —SlamDiego 03:25, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Events of the case

Is it me or do the first 3 paragraphs beneath the header "Events of the case" seem somewhat out of order, or merely slightly muddled? — Preceding unsigned comment added by U91731 (talk • contribs) 19:02, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

It's not you. I just revised the section, hopefully for the better. Thanks for bringing it up. --CliffC (talk) 23:25, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

Redundancy

The single paragraph of "Early Life" and the first three paragraphs of "Events of the Case" are completely redundant, reiterating essentially the same information several times. 18:56, 22 March 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Commonlaw504 (talk • contribs)

Poison/Infection

The opening states she was killed by infection, when its actually unknown and poisoning was more likely. This ends up sounding biased because there are basically two schools of thought. Doctors testified to both in the case. Please edit. http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/stephenson/stephensonaccount.html ```` — Preceding unsigned comment added by Flashhat (talk • contribs) 00:14, 24 February 2012 (UTC)

Question

Why is this page listed under Cannibalised people? I couldn't find a clear reference to cannibalism in the text, other than that Stephenson bit her. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 146.185.54.54 (talk) 14:19, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

Shorty

"The next morning, she convinced Stephenson to call Shorty and tell him to come to the hotel so she could purchase a black silk hat." Who is Shorty? Stephenson's chauffeur, perhaps? He should be properly identified in the article. 71.235.184.247 (talk) 22:04, 8 February 2019 (UTC)

Yeah, that's his chauffeur, Shorty DeFriese. It's been clarified in the article. spoko (talk) 18:06, 12 August 2024 (UTC)

Stephenson 1961 assault arrest

The last sentence of the article says that "In 1961, Stephenson was arrested in Tennessee at age 70 on charges of sexually assaulting a 16-year-old girl, but the charges were dropped on grounds of insufficient evidence." But the linked document says that in 1961 he was arrested in Missouri for assaulting a 16-year-old girl, then was convicted but subsequently paroled on condition that he leave the state. Not sure where the Tennessee references come from. I don't know whether it's better to replace it with the facts about this Missouri incident, or find a citation for the Tennessee incident and list both, or what. spoko (talk) 20:43, 31 May 2024 (UTC)