Talk:A. B. Rogers

Year of discovery

I believe it is inaccurate to say that he had only "observed it from a distance" in 1881 - his journals make it clear that they made it all the way to the continental divide in 1881. It is true that he was unable to traverse to the other side, but from their high vantage point on 29 May they could see that the pass must exist. Newspapers also reported the discovery of the pass prior to his return the next year. Fawcett5 16:47, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)

• I don't have access to the journals right now so I defer to your reading. I believe the "failed to reach the pass by a mere eighteen miles"(from the article) is incorrect. Berton wrote about 1881 trip, "There were eighteen unexplored miles left [from the pass, east to the Columbia River]" (Last Spike p148). Berton also writes that in 1882, "There, before them, was the very peak on which he had stood in the summer of 1881 and there was the same broad meadow [at the pass] that he had spied from his vantage point." (Last Spike p162). While the Berton description from 1881 is a little vague, it suggests that Rogers saw the pass from the peak in 1881 but didn't reach the meadow until 1882. Interestingly, the first party to traverse the pass (at least east to west) was Sandford Flemings party in 1883 (England and Canada, p269) with the railway already built to past Calgary. Al guy 17:47, Mar 25, 2005 (UTC)

You didn't quote the whole paragraph. "Unfortunatley, he could not be sure. There were eighteen unexplored miles left, but by this time the party was almost out of food. Rogers's notorious frugality had destroyed all chances of finding a pass in the season of 1881; he did not have supplies enough to allow him to press forward and so was forced to order his men to turn their backs on that tantalizing divide and head west again. He must have been bitterly disappointed. It would be at least another year before he would be able to say for certain whether a practical route for a railway led from the Beaver to the Illecilleweat. By that time the rails would be approaching the valley of the Bow, and he still had not explored the Kicking Horse Pass in the Rockies, which had scarcely been glimpsed since the day when James Hector, Palliser's geologist first saw it in 1858.

Further, P.160 he had to go to Montreal to explain himself. "In truth, Rogers had discovered half a pass only. To confirm his findings he would have to scale the eastern wall of the Selkirks and make sure that the gap he thought he saw from the Illecillewaet actually pierced the mountain barrier."

Also, P.162 "There was a way through the Selkirks afterall, and its discovery would make him immortal. Almost from this moment, this smiling, mountain-ringed meadow would bear the name of Rogers's Pass. The date was July 24, 1882. ......"

Pretty clear to me. R.L.Kennedy 21:42, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)

• Please forgive me if I'm missing something here, but the "eighteen miles" referred to in that paragraph quoted above is the distance from the pass east down the Beaver River to the Columbia River (ie 'half the pass'). It is only about 45 miles from Revelstoke to the Pass so if he had been 18 miles short of the pass, it is unlikely he would be able to see the pass.

In my reading, in 1881, he looked down upon the meadow at the pass from a nearby mountain just west of the pass (likely from only a mile or two from the pass). In 1882, he approached the pass from the eastern side and got to the meadow he had seen the previous year. Some would say that he only discovered the pass after he explored both sides (ie 1882) - others would say that he discovered it in 1881 and confirmed it in 1882. Al guy 23:03, Mar 25, 2005 (UTC)

My interpretation is that he discovered the pass in 1881, and only confirmed its suitability for a railway in 1882. Berton tries to have it both ways in his book. Fawcett5 23:07, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)

A.O. Wheeler's book "The Selkirk Range" (1905) includes a first-hand account of the discovery of the pass by a member of Rogers' party, his nephew A.L. Rogers, which makes it clear that they reached the pass in 1881. According to A.L. Rogers, they followed the Illecillewaet to where it dwindled to a small stream, and on May 28, 1881 they skirted a "great triangular peak" (Mt Sir Donald) to reach "a large level opening which appeared to be the summit", i.e. the pass. Here the waters divided, flowing east and west. To get a better view, they climbed from the pass to the crest of a nearby mountain ridge (the ridge between Mt Macdonald and Avalanche Mountain, according to Wheeler). From the ridge they could see the Beaver River valley on the east side of the Selkirks. However, they turned around without exploring the eastern approach to the pass. Mkleroux 09:25, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

questionable addition

the following was found at the end of a section:

Also major AB rogers was in charge of the pacific railway and he wanted mc donalds dream to come true after mc donald past away. every one thought that his dream should come true and his wife died in the meantime haha

I suspect that this was added as a rough joke, due to the nature of the formatting. DocKrin (talk) 22:50, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

additionally, there is no mention of the framed cheque or the gold pocket watch in the Dictionary of Canadian Biography on line, which is curious, as that would be the kind of trivial detail that would bring this person 'to life' in the mind of the reader. I did find a reference to the pocket watch here: http://www.associatepublisher.com/e/a/a/a._b._rogers.htm, and have added that reference while deleting the last line from that block.

DocKrin (talk) 22:54, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

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