Talk:Lists of Jews

This article was nominated for deletion on August 9, 2005. The result of the discussion was keep.

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1

Are the Jews a religious group?

Is there a similar list about christian, muslim and hindi people? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 85.224.176.181 (talk • contribs) 22:38, 27 November 2005.

There is a misunderstanding here, Jewish is not just a religion it is an ethnicity too, and yes there are many lists for other ethnicities such as African Americans etc. Arniep 23:02, 27 November 2005 (UTC) (But unlike African Americans, Jews are not differentiated by how they look--but by their religion or identification with history. So many people who are descended from Jews do not identify with the religion or history--or are even "anti-semitic". So can they be classified as Jews, if they don't see themselves as Jews? No. So adding them to a list of Jews is a somewhat like the Nazis classifying every person who has a bit of what they called "Jewish blood" (of course nonesense) as Jewish! If anything this page is an attempt at guessing the religious beliefs or traditions of famous personalities!)[reply]

There are lists for EVERY major American ethnicity. If there weren't before than there sure are now, I've spent the last few months adding any absent ones. There are also lists and categories for all religions.Vulturell 23:35, 27 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Jews as an ethnicity are long extinct, all trace their ancestry to Europe, and no relation to ancient kingdom of israel. 2A00:23CC:B589:EF01:5CC0:E2C2:7804:9E62 (talk) 02:57, 5 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agree with Arniep and Vulturel. Reminds me, I created from scratch a list of persons from a similar ethnicity, the Druze. The list is in Dutch: w:nl:Lijst_van_bekende_Druzen (I see that someone vandalised it). I will see if I can find time to translate it to English. 22:40, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

Don't Forget Hefner's GF: Barbie Benton (Born Barbara Kline)

It is incompatible with law of many countries to have a list of people.--Nixer 18:59, 28 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Which law? In which countries? And have you noticed the message at the top that previous attempts to delete this have failed? JFW | T@lk 08:42, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

It's probably pointless to say this, but I agree that these lists should be deleted. I find them deeply problematic, ranging from there being no agreed or consistent definition; to identifying people as Jews who may not see themselves as Jews and who no one else may see as a Jew either; and then there's the issue that for some of the names on these lists, the only online sources are Stormfront, Islamist sites and Wikipedia mirrors, which I think should make us question what we're doing. SlimVirgin ^(talk) 08:58, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Having a few LIMITED lists of VERY famous Jews is interesting and acceptable when restricted to such individuals as people of Jewish ancestry that had won Nobel Prizes. But over the past year, these lists and categories of Jews have gotten crazily out of hand, and may even pose a danger to living (allegedly "Jewish") people on them when put into the wrong hands. The vast majority of Wikipedia lists and categories of Jews are not of any encyclopedic or of scholarly value and on the whole the total project of collecting names of Jews seems like a violation of Wikipedia:No original research. Finally, and here is one of the great dangers posed by these lists and categories of Jews, is that Wikipedia is not and should not appear to be in the same "line of business" of the abominable Jew Watch hate site. IZAK 04:08, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, EVERY SINGLE ONE of the many ethnicity-based lists here would be a violation of Wikipedia:No original research, but of course no one here would ever care to bring up any similar concerns on List of Italian Americans or List of Norwegian-Americans. Same old, same old. Vulturell 04:27, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Vulturell: Jews are different. They are both a religion and an "ethnicity" (compare the Jew and Judaism articles), and they have been the victims of ongoings persecutions for most of their history (or do you deny that?). You do seem to denigrate ("Same old, same old" are your words) and deliberately ignore the fact that, unfortunately, historically Jews have been victims of genocidal Anti-Semitism as in the Holocaust when being identified as a Jew, no matter how remotely, could result in a death sentence (or do you wish to ignore and belittle that as well?) That is why Jew Watch is so obnoxious and dangerous. This matter is of particular concern to any people who are alive and find themslves on lists or categories that they may not want to be on. There are some pretty nasty debates going on about similar and related issues right now on Wikipedia concerning people who do not wish to have articles about them published on Wikipedia, so I wouldn't poo-poo it so quickly if I were you. IZAK 06:01, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

OK, of course part of my point is we have many religion-based lists too, etc. etc. i.e. List_of_Catholic_American_Actors, etc. etc. So, your point here was, that basically we should delete the List of Jews and keep every other ethnicity and religion based list? Not a valid point. Armenians were slaughtered in the millions about a hundred years ago, no one is complaining about List of Armenians. Oh, and for the lovva, don't follow the cliche and go around reverting every one of my edits (well, every one that had to do with this subject matter, as per usual). Anyway, frankly, I'm not going to get involved in this discussion again. I am in sincere doubt that there is anything we could possibly say to each other that we both don't already know. Counter-productive. Thank you for your vote on the Somerhalder hoax, btw, I can't believe it was on here for three months without anyone noticing. I guess people were too busy debating this endless topic. Vulturell 06:37, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I find this list useful in the scholarly sense. I think this list exist for many other groups so a list for outstanding Jewish individuals is not exceptional . Jews are overly paranoid about everything even though they run all major institutions from banks, universities, to political parties. To all my Jewish friends: don't be so paranoid and people won't hate you.

Excessive Categorization

1) Fact: From previous discussions we have seen that some people do not want others to view a list of Jews. 2) Assuming that if I was that person who did not want people to view such list of Jews, I might find it strategic to break up the list into excessive categories. This way my audience couldn't view a SIMPLE LIST OF JEWS. 3) So I believe we must also make a list of Jews categorized by ALPHABETICAL ORDER RATHER THAN, OR IN ADDITION TO, CATEGORIZATION BY PROFESSION. Why should we unecessarily force readers to know an attribute about the Jew (like profession) and subsequently FORCE THEM TO ISOLATE ALL OTHER JEWS?

PLEASE MAKE NECESSARY CHANGES

Delete these lists

We should delete this because this is ovious racism. It is incompatible with law of many countries.--Nixer 18:59, 28 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Which law? In which countries? And have you noticed the message at the top that previous attempts to delete this have failed? JFW | T@lk 08:42, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

It's probably pointless to say this, but I agree that these lists should be deleted. I find them deeply problematic, ranging from there being no agreed or consistent definition; to identifying people as Jews who may not see themselves as Jews and who no one else may see as a Jew either; and then there's the issue that for some of the names on these lists, the only online sources are Stormfront, Islamist sites and Wikipedia mirrors, which I think should make us question what we're doing. SlimVirgin ^(talk) 08:58, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Having a few LIMITED lists of VERY famous Jews is interesting and acceptable when restricted to such individuals as people of Jewish ancestry that had won Nobel Prizes. But over the past year, these lists and categories of Jews have gotten crazily out of hand, and may even pose a danger to living (allegedly "Jewish") people on them when put into the wrong hands. The vast majority of Wikipedia lists and categories of Jews are not of any encyclopedic or of scholarly value and on the whole the total project of collecting names of Jews seems like a violation of Wikipedia:No original research. Finally, and here is one of the great dangers posed by these lists and categories of Jews, is that Wikipedia is not and should not appear to be in the same "line of business" of the abominable Jew Watch hate site. IZAK 04:08, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, EVERY SINGLE ONE of the many ethnicity-based lists here would be a violation of Wikipedia:No original research, but of course no one here would ever care to bring up any similar concerns on List of Italian Americans or List of Norwegian-Americans. Same old, same old. Vulturell 04:27, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Vulturell: Jews are different. They are both a religion and an "ethnicity" (compare the Jew and Judaism articles), and they have been the victims of ongoings persecutions for most of their history (or do you deny that?). You do seem to denigrate ("Same old, same old" are your words) and deliberately ignore the fact that, unfortunately, historically Jews have been victims of genocidal Anti-Semitism as in the Holocaust when being identified as a Jew, no matter how remotely, could result in a death sentence (or do you wish to ignore and belittle that as well?) That is why Jew Watch is so obnoxious and dangerous. This matter is of particular concern to any people who are alive and find themslves on lists or categories that they may not want to be on. There are some pretty nasty debates going on about similar and related issues right now on Wikipedia concerning people who do not wish to have articles about them published on Wikipedia, so I wouldn't poo-poo it so quickly if I were you. IZAK 06:01, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

OK, of course part of my point is we have many religion-based lists too, etc. etc. i.e. List_of_Catholic_American_Actors, etc. etc. So, your point here was, that basically we should delete the List of Jews and keep every other ethnicity and religion based list? Not a valid point. Armenians were slaughtered in the millions about a hundred years ago, no one is complaining about List of Armenians. Oh, and for the lovva, don't follow the cliche and go around reverting every one of my edits (well, every one that had to do with this subject matter, as per usual). Anyway, frankly, I'm not going to get involved in this discussion again. I am in sincere doubt that there is anything we could possibly say to each other that we both don't already know. Counter-productive. Thank you for your vote on the Somerhalder hoax, btw, I can't believe it was on here for three months without anyone noticing. I guess people were too busy debating this endless topic. Vulturell 06:37, 30 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Trouble

For anyone seriously working on this page - please check out Wikipedia talk:Centralized discussion/Lists by religion-ethnicity and profession. User:IZAK is rallying to mass-delete these lists, so feel free to vote if you've worked on them and want them kept (or even if you haven't worked on them and want them kept). Vulturell 20:10, 4 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ive noticed these lists don't include (in)famous criminals, perverts, traitors, etc. Bugsy Segal of the Jewish Mafia for example. I haven't looked to see if there are lists of famous terrorists of various races, religions or nationalities. But all these bad guys should be included according to our neutrality & balance & "due weight" rules. Fourtildas 06:45, 25 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I don't understand this comment. Bugsy Siegel and others are on List of Jewish-American mobsters. The trouble with a list of terrorists is that you'd never get consensus on who is a terrorist.--20.138.246.89 10:25, 25 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

where are the famous jews in economics? that's probably a big missing subpoint? Or are you afraid to take it into the listing?

My revert

I just reverted Sheynhertz-Unbayg's edit by mistake, so I reverted myself, without commenting on whether I think the edits were good or bad, because I've no idea. Sorry for any confusion. SlimVirgin ^(talk) 10:31, 31 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Salam/Sholom

Guys, i need help: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Muslim politicians

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Muslim athletes

Lets stop this anti-list deletion trend, before all lists are consumed.

Peace!

--Striver 04:40, 21 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

If you're so against the "anti-list deletion trend" why do you keep on nominating this page for deletion, without any warranted reason? I suggest basing your wikipedia actions on what you actually think should or shouldn't be included, not your quest of veangance after someone nominated Lists of Muslims for deletion. Yid613 08:00, 21 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It is perfectly legal to AFD a article witout supporting its deletion. Or did you just made up a new rule? I have even AFD my own new articles that i knew where controversial, just to get it overwith. AFD is a disscussion, and i want that disscution to involve this article as well. user CltFn wanted this SPECIFIC article deleted and so did even the nominator it self, for a while! Dont delet tags in mid afd, that is a violation. --Striver 11:17, 21 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Further, that AFD does, due the the choice of the nominator, include several lists from several different beliefs--Striver 11:19, 21 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Umm, an article being "controversial" does not mean that there are grounds for deletion. I suggest you read up on wikipedia policy again. Yid613 18:52, 21 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This article has been nominated for deletion as retribution for another AfD nomination. This is in violation of Wikipedia guideline don't disrupt Wikipedia to illustrate a point. Weregerbil 13:04, 21 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Jewish American Linguists

How is this list RELEVANT to this index? It belongs in the List of Jewish Americans index. This an index for non-nation-tied Jewish lists - thats for List of Jews by country. Same theory goes behind the Israeli list - it is inappropriate here, especially considering not all Israeli are Jewish.

The following is to help User:Newport understand the changes that have been made. Wikipedia lists are usually indexes. In the case of Jewish lists, there are two separate indexes:

List of Jews by country
List of Jews (by occupation)

List of Jewish American linguists ..I'm not sure how anyone can confuse this... belongs quite clearly in List of Jewish Americans, which is part of List of Jews by country.

While the Israeli list is totally inappropriate here because not all Israelis are Jews. It would be the equivalent of adding a List of Brooklynites to List of Jews. Put the Israeli list in another index - most clearly: List of Israelis.

72.144.183.163 15:54, 9 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

What Wikipedia policy or even statement in this article requires it to be just a List of Jews by occupation? This list is a guidepost to people exploring lists of Jews. Will the deletions make the list more useful? If anyone can show that they do, then by all means let's make the deletions.--Newport 11:33, 12 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Why does "List of Jewish American linguists" get to be here but not "List of Jewish American architects." Why are you so pointlessly stubborn about this? What harm does it do to put "List of Jewish American linguists" in its rightful place: List of Jewish Americans? I have no idea why you keep re-miscategorizing it.

Also from what I looked at, list of fictitious Jews has the whole List of Jewish superheroes inside of it.....hence the redirect. Why are you continuously making two different pages for the same material?

If anyone think the List of Jewish American architects should be here, please add it. The linguists is a side issue; other entries are repeatedly being deleted for unexplained reasons. The issue is whether these deletions make the article more useful; I have seen no evidence for that contention. --Newport 11:35, 21 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

adding a list

List of High Priests of Israel is a list of Jews, should it be added? Jon513 11:46, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Done. -- -- -- 23:36, 25 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Lists of people by nationality

This article includes lists of people by nationality. e.g. List of British Jews.--Runcorn 20:02, 25 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Lists of Jews...LOL!

hahahaha, sorry, i'm not a racist, but i find this list pretty funny XD

Wait'll you see the next article, Lists of people who find lists of Jews funny.Gzuckier 14:55, 17 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Come on, Gzuckier. Lots of Jews (and Gentiles) get nervous when long lists of Jews start to get drawn up. I'm sure you can figure out why--though that's not a reason for eliminating such a list, of course.

LIST OF JEWS??? Give me a break!

Jewish Nobel Laureates

Why has the list of Jewish Nobel Laureates been deleted? Phtran72 00:30, 19 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I second that - why has that list been deleted? Is it unreasonable for me to want to find out accomplishments of people from my religious/ethnic group?:: Monitorer 10:32, 19 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It appears that the list of Jewish Nobel Laureates was deleted during a mass deletion of lists of Christian/Muslim/Atheist/Humanist/Hindu Nobel Laureates. Reasons given were that Nobel prizes are not awarded on the basis of religion, and that there is no obvious connection between a Laureate's work and her religion. My objections are, firstly, Jews are more an ethnicity than a religious grouping. And, secondly, it is precisely because of the assumption that there is no connection between being Jewish and winning Nobel prizes that the List of Jewish Nobel Laureates should be kept, since it completely shatters that assumption. If being Jewish is not a factor in winning Nobel Prizes, then why do Jews make up 20-25% of Nobel Laureates despite being just 0.2% of the world's population? (I hope I'm remembering those numbers correctly.) This is a very interesting fact that should be documented, as it is the focus of much debate and scholarship. Phtran72 12:33, 19 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I am not sure what was happening in 2007, but I restored the wikilink to List of Jewish Nobel laureates. Blue Rasberry 00:47, 4 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Jewish Jewelers

Hey I think its a great idea to add a section dedicated to Jewish Jewelers. There are many prominent Jewish Jewelers out there; enough to make a whole sction about. Im new to wikipedia but I think someone with more knowledge can create this.Levi Seigel (talk) 02:27, 11 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Lol. Wouldn't hurt to have one I suppose. They make quality jewelry. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.109.147.100 (talk) 05:07, 27 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

AfD

I've nominated List of former Jews, List of former Christians, and List of former Muslims together for deletion: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of former Jews.Kitfoxxe (talk) 17:23, 31 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Video Games Designers/Producers etc.

Ken Levine (2K Boston)
Jason Rubine (Naughty Dog)
Irving Bromberg (SEGA)
Michael Kogan (Taito)
Jordan Weisman
Jordan Mechner
Ken Silverman
Ralph H. Baer
Doug Lowenstein —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.49.249.248 (talk) 23:28, 3 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Req: Move

Does anyone else think this article should be moved to "List of Notable Jews". Seeing a link to "List of Jews" was a little strange for me (i'm sorry if this has been discussed before, I didn't see any other topics that IMMIEDIETLY looked like they were regarding the name). 30daysinAKK (talk) 02:51, 11 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

You miss the point. It would be redundant in terms of Wikipedia policies to add the word "Notable". The list is automatically understood to be of notable Jews only because non-notable personalities and subjects are not considered for inclusion and are deleted on Wikipedia. IZAK (talk) 06:39, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Aint these lists kind of racist?

I know this has been pointed out (many times) before, but why a list of e.g. Hispanic baseball players would be pointless and kind of racist, but these are not? Can't see any difference... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 120.148.214.126 (talk • contribs) 12:15, 9 December 2013‎

I tend to agree. Beyond that, they're useless lists. Toddst1 (talk) 14:12, 9 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

No. Wikipedia has the exact same pages for Lists of Muslims, List of Hindus, and others, and there are even some lists of Hisanics as well. So there's also this one, and nothing is racist about it whatsoever, and, of course, it's only your own opinion which thinks the page is pointless. Keep in mind that any person can be a Jew either by convertion, religion, or just ethnicity. -Shalom11111 (talk) 19:16, 14 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I see: WP:OSE. Toddst1 (talk) 00:24, 26 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I think these lists are important because they help us take care of orphaned articles. So, if the subject of the orphaned article is a Jew, just add his name to the appropriate list of Jews; if he's a Muslim, add him to the list of Muslims, and so on. -- -- -- 07:58, 29 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. I also don't see why they would be considered racist. -- -- -- 08:00, 29 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]